No Gas In Atlanta - Panic Ensues


While I was in my blissful poetry weekend, I decided to turn off the telly and not pay any attention to politics or local news. Silly me. I had heard there were gas shortages at some stations in Atlanta, but didn't realize the full scope until today. Gasoline is very hard to come by in the metro Atlanta area and there has been a full on panic

After work, my low fuel light came on and I figured I'd have to drive around to a few stations to find working pumps. A tour of southeast Atlanta ensued. No gas anywhere. Then I started to panic a little bit myself. Of course, I'm driving around wasting gas looking for gas, and I finally gave up and came home. BFF Mal called later on and said there was gas at the QuickTrip on Briarcliff Road, but the cars were five deep (which was better than the hour and a half wait at many stations today). So, about 7:30 p.m. I jumped in the car and raced up to the QuickTrip and there was indeed a wait, but I managed to fill up my tank. Sadly, there were morons there in their giant SUVs, not only filling them up but filling up multiple gas cans. That's why we have no gas...okay, not the only reason, but that kind of over-buying is why there's none to go around.

Atlanta is under EPA restrictions because this place is one big smog bowl, so we are required to have "boutique" gasoline, which burns cleaner. With Hurricanes Ike and Gustav slamming into the Gulf Coast, refining has been disrupted and we're in an even bigger mess here because we need a special kind of gas. Our Republican right wing sonofabitch Gov. Sonny Purdue ignored warnings that Atlanta could be facing a gasoline shortage and waited until late this afternoon to ask the EPA to temporarily waive the restrictions. God knows how long it will take to cut all that red tape. 

We have inadequate public transport in Atlanta. Despite having a subway, it goes nowhere and, like Los Angeles, the metro area is a one big sprawl. And also like LA, we have a car culture here. There's been plenty of bitching and moaning on lots of local blogs blaming Bush (he's only partly to blame), but this kind of gas shortage is a harbinger of things to come if America doesn't seriously begin moving toward alternative fuels, and I don't mean more drilling for oil. With the economy collapsing and now this, it feels like this country is teetering on precipice and one more disaster will send us right over the edge. Thank god the Democrats are pushing back on the Bush Administration's blank check to bail out Wall Street. This administration seems hellbent on driving the country right into the ground before Bush leaves office.

Comments

jeannine said…
Dear Collin,
I'm so sorry about the gas shortage - yikes! I have to say that your two paragraphs about the reasons for Atlanta and Tennessee shortages are the best, most succinct and fact-filled I've seen - after reading several articles from CNN - maybe you should start writing for them! Here's hoping solar cars are in the near future (what? I think that'd be awesome! Much better than electric...)
KATE EVANS said…
This is so strange! Did you have a flashback to the 70s??

Bush & Co. are leaving a virtual post-apocalyptic world in their wake.
Anonymous said…
Correct me if i'm wrong, but I believe the Democrats gave Bush this authority back in July of this year. So you can't blame this one entirely on Bush, there are at least 50 Democrats in the Senate and 100s more in the House who passed the bill that Bush signed to ramp up the Corporate Welfare. This is unAmerican and anti capitalist.
Rachel Mallino said…
Hey Collin, I was just about to blog about the gas thing! We are having issues up here in Charlotte, too. Hubby couldn't find gas yesterday to go to work - you make some good points.
Fiscally Conservative Bible Believer said…
"Thank god the Democrats are pushing back on the Bush Administration's blank check to bail out Wall Street."

What?!?!?!? The Democrats are pretty much trying to give Liberal Bush the blank check. $700 Billion is pretty close to infinity as far as I can tell.

Wake up! Its the Conservative Republicans in Congress trying to stop this bail out madness.
Collin said…
Oh, please, it wasn't until Nancy Pelosi stepped up and said "hold on a second" and McCain and Co. realized they were once again out of step with what's happening in this country did the Republicans start coming around so they wouldn't look like they were in lockstep with Dubya. Bush wanted the thing passed with no oversight. You really need to pay more attention.
poetwithadayjob said…
Collin for f*ck's sake! I am so sorry on behalf of the City of $5 Dollar Gas about your plight! It's truly a sign, and not a good one. It totally unnerves me but at the same time, it's not like we don't see this all coming.

On a side note, I just wrote a poem about the gas lines in the 70s we all experienced.

And on another side note, we're really mad at Nancy over here. Really mad.
Fiscally Conservative Bible Believer said…
Sir, I think you're the one who needs to pay attention. McCain has stated that he is completely against these bail outs. Bush is wrong and the Democrats are wrong. The majority of the Republicans in Congress are against the bail outs, blank checks etc. Its the Dems who are whooped up in a Frenzy lockstep with Dubya, (not the Republicans). Read more than one news source for crying out loud.
Collin said…
What's really happening here is that the Democrats are being backed into a corner of having to approve the bailout because the Republicans who supported Bush for the last eight years don't want to dirty their hands with him anymore. By voting no, they punt to the Democrats and make them do the deed, which makes McCain look better.

In the meantime, McCain said this week he still plans to extend Bush's tax cuts for high-income Americans, even though the proposed bailout would add hundreds of billions of dollars to the federal deficit. Which means totally screwing the middle class.

Yeah, you right wing fucks are all class. And I see you're still anonymous, too. When are you going to grow a pair Bible thumper wingnut and sign your name?
Collin said…
And let me also add, that it was the Dems who put the brakes on the blank check by countering with a proposal to slow foreclosures and cap compensation for the Wall Street chiefs whose companies are being bailed out. Many of the Republicans don't want to see their fat-cat Wall Street friends out of cash (who will contribute to their campaigns?).

The Republicans appear to be split on what to do about the bailout, because they know they are damned if they do, damned if they don't. Every poll taken this week puts the blame on this economic cockup squarely in the Republicans' laps and since McCain has no real idea how to fix the economy (it's fundamentally strong, you know), he's happy sit back and carry on Dubya's idea of giving more to the rich and shitting on the middle class.

It's amazing how much of a populist McCain has become in the last week since his numbers started going south and the shine wore off Palin. Mavericks. Bitch, please...
Lisa Allender said…
Yep. Anyone who reads or knows history at all, knows John McCain was the biggest de-regulator, EVER. Deregulation DOES help in certain markets(phone company deregulation back in late 70's/early '80's gave us wide choices of which service-provider to use, which lowered prices via direct competition for our $$, and the "free market" was shown to work.)BUT:
it doesn't work in EVERY sector--by now we all know the airlines got bailed out a few years ago(again, by the gov't--that means you & me, kids!), and of course, now we see--GREED on Wall Street means once again, these folks ABUSED the market--I'd say the Dems are the ONLY ones making any sense right now, as they want:
1) to make certain it's not a "blank check" written
2) caps are put on what the execs can walk away with--no golden parachutes for their poor decision making/shameless hustling of their employees/investors
3) increased INDEPENDENT oversight to make certain this does not happen, again!
The Repubs just want the 700 Billion--they just want the bail-out, no strings attached--which is incredibly ironic, given that they are the ones who normally argue for "deregulation", and NO gov't "interference".
I agree, Coll, it's as if they(Repubs) want to run this country even more into the ground. It's just pathetic!
M. RuPere said…
and it really all started w Ronnie-boy Reagan and his de-regulate mania - so if you give him credit for bringing down communism, now ya gotta give him props for bringing down capitalism lol
Bible thumper wingnut said…
You're being spun. Deregulation is not the problem. The problem is that the free market is not being allowed to function. Free Market Capitalism is a good thing. When government steps in and props up failed individuals (the ones who could not handle a mortgage) and when the government steps in to prop up failed corporations then we all loose on many levels. We loose as consumers and we looses as tax payers. If the government would step aside and let the Free Market run its course. Then other banks would eat these failed banks. Middle Class Entrepreneur types would bail out these families. Sure, the parties being 'bailed out' by the free market would not get the best deal. BUT they should not have gotten in this situation in the first place. The Bible says that the borrower is slave to the lender and that debt is a curse. That's why my house is paid off and I don't use credit cards for material purchases. (nor do I really use them....)

You make me laugh by using a poll to gauge at whose fault here. The Republicans in Congress are not backing the Dems into a corner and making them do this as you say. They're like me, they're furious that the government keeps monkeying with everything. Government is indeed dragging this 'crisis' out. Government is just looking for more excuses to be BIGGER.
Collin said…
We're being spun? You're rhetoric and unbelievably narrow approach to politics is tainted by your right wing Christian faith. Go peddle your bullshit to the Limbaugh, Hannity and Pat Robertson crowd. No one is buying here.
Lisa Allender said…
Rupert--It was definitely Reagan who led the cry of smaller gov't/deregulation. Point.
Collin, I think Right-Wing Bible Thumper is living in fantasy-land. Sure it's nice to imagine the free market could "correct" itself, but that's NOT happening, and in the meantime, many folks who were about to retire, CANNOT. If they try to, they'll lose 1/4 to 1/3 of their LIFE'S SAVINGS.
I wonder what woulda happened if George W., John McCain and all the other Repubs had gotten their way, only a few years ago--you remember, they wanted to PRIVATIZE Social Security, by investing in high-risk, supposedly "high-yield" stocks,(John McCain-- hypocrite that he is-- recently called Wall Street "the biggest casino in the world..").
Nice to see that once again, Repubs like to play fast and loose with OPM(Other People's Money)
Bible thumper wingnut said…
Using foul language and labeling shows that you are the one who is narrow minded and not open for debate.
Collin said…
You are really spot on with this Lisa. Thanks for contributing to the debate.
Bible thumper wingnut said…
Lisa, Interesting point about privatizing social security. I know this, if social security did not exist and if 'Big Brother' wasn't trying to take care of me and keep me from my IRA plan, I would have retired at the age of 32. That's right, I would not be working to pay for the mistakes of irresponsible corporations and irresponsible individuals.
Collin said…
It must be nice to be so privileged that you could live without Social Security after retirement. Unfortunately, that's not the case for most Americans. My parents worked hard all their lives and if it wasn't for SS they would be in serious financial trouble. This is just more proof that you have no idea what's really going on in this country. No wonder you're supporting McCain.

And, by the way, please refrain from scolding me about my language and tone. This is my blog. If you don't like it, move along or get your own. You've yet to answer why you're such a coward about signing your name. You're just like all the nuts who call into the conservative talk shows and spout ignorance because they're identity is hidden. Why don't you put your name where your mouth -- and faith -- is?
Right wing coward said…
I never said that I supported McCain, and you also never answered many of my questions in your Palin post.

Funny, my grandfather worked hard is whole life too and is semi dependent on social security. If government had not robbed that money from him his whole life he could have invested it and be living without any government assistance.

Friend, don't get me wrong. I was born with no silver spoon in my mouth. I started working (illegally) at the age of 12 doing construction work. Later, I bussed tables and did odd jobs through high school. In college, I fell back on what I knew in the summers and did more heavy labor construction work in the hot south GA sun. I got my degree and started white collar work after college and have since given more than 10% (before tax) of my money away for free to charity. I live below my means and save 10% to 15% of my income per month. I have a family I'm supporting. Its not just me. And my income is under $75K / year. My wife does not work. And I have the fear of the reality that I could loose my job any day. But if that happened, I'll hustle and God will see me through.

If a liberal looses his job, he goes to the alter of Big Government.
Collin said…
So you'll be pulling the lever for Obama then? Great news.
Bible thumper wingnut said…
You thought I was scolding you? That wasn't the case; I was just making an observation.
Rachel Mallino said…
"if that happened I'll hustle and God will see me through"

I just need to comment on this, firstly it's fucking absurd (hey collin, can I curse?) You'll hustle? Hustle what, exactly? And what happens when you find yourself unable to "hustle" because the people your hustling have no money to offer you for your duties? What then? Unemployment? You've got a family -oh, don't tell me for a second you wouldn't file for unemployment benefits, and when you do, make sure you bow down to the altar of the democrats (who, btw, just recently passed a bill to extend unemployment benefits).

Terrified of losing your job? Say thanks to big corp. for that - for shipping all of our jobs overseas - thank the republicans for that.

What you say and what you say you believe come across as two very different things.

Don't worry, no one is trying to convert you - ignorance runs deep, way too deep for even any elitist democrat to wade through.
Bible thumper wingnut said…
Rachel Mallino,
Your tone is condescending and hateful. Typical of narrow minded liberals. Sure, you can curse at me if you like, you're really just showing your character and class.

If I loose my nice white collar job. I'm out the door delivering pizzas. If that doesn't work, I'm going door to door doing whatever.

God has given me time and I have taken advantage of it to develop many skills and talents.

If worse comes to worse, we'll live out of a tent. I know of other fellow right-wing-self-sufficient nuts who have done just that in hard times.

Or if I have to, I'll do like my grandfather's family did in the depression. Rent an acre of land and grow food on it. Whatever.

The point is, government is the problem and government wants more power. We are really all slaves and serfs in this modern day feudalistic/plantation society.
Joel Odom said…
This has got to be the most liberal crowd I've seen. "Bible thumper" is obviously a tongue-in-cheek fellow who can laugh at himself while still clearly explaining his convictions, and y'all mostly swear at him and call him names. Where's the intelligence in that?
Rachel Mallino said…
Bible Thumper, I'm curious - do your kids go to public schools?

You'll rent land, really? With no job? You'll have the money to do that, to buy the equipment you'll need to sow the land? And who's buying? Again, you can have many trades and skills - that doesn't mean that in a very weak economy that enough people are going to need or pay for your duties.

So, are you saying you would or you would not apply for unemployment benefits, should you lose your job?

Hateful? Condescending? All yes. I'm not afraid to say that I am hateful towards ignorant people. I'm part of the middle class in this country who is sick and tired of being shit on. And yes, that has turned into hatred for those who are hell-bent on oppressing the working middle class. I'm a passionate person, you don't have to like me and I don't care what your opinion of me is.

This country is so divided that I honestly don't know if we can ever come together.
Bible thumper wingnut said…
Rachel Mallino,

You should open your mind and be creative with what God has given you and not look to government for your answers. Below, I have tried to answer some of your questions.

Bible Thumper, I'm curious - do your kids go to public schools?
No. Ironic though since tax dollars have been taken from me to support public schools, but the government won't give me a voucher to cover my private school expenses.

You'll rent land, really? With no job?
Yes, I have money to rent land right now, because I have saved up for hard times. I learned to do this by following the advice from the book of Proverbs in the Bible.

You'll have the money to do that, to buy the equipment you'll need to sow the land?
Shovels and hoes are pretty cheep the last time I checked. Horses cost less than a 7 year old used Honda civic. Again, following the advice of Proverbs has allowed me to save a little for tough times.

And who's buying?
No one. It would be food for me and my family until the government decided it was not fair and begin confiscation of the fruits of my labor to redistribute to others who did not work for it nor earn it.

So, are you saying you would or you would not apply for unemployment benefits, should you lose your job?
I should, because of all the money confiscated from me in the past to support unemployment. It’s the system that I’ve been FORCED into. But no, I don’t need that money.

Hateful? Condescending? All yes. I'm not afraid to say that I am hateful towards ignorant people.
I support missionaries who carry love and hope to ignorant people. I say ignorant in the sense that they are unschooled and are oppressed. First we bring love, then hope, then education.

I'm part of the middle class in this country who is sick and tired of being shit on. And yes, that has turned into hatred for those who are hell-bent on oppressing the working middle class.
I’m in the middle class too and I’m tired of being pushed down. I want government to get off my back so that I can produce!

I'm a passionate person, you don't have to like me and I don't care what your opinion of me is.
I never said that I didn’t like you.

This country is so divided that I honestly don't know if we can ever come together.
That is why I’m here in this liberal blog, trying to find common ground. But the host wants me to leave.
Joel Odom said…
Bible thumper, I think what you're trying to communicate is that government is not the answer to all of the hard things that happen in the world. You mention missionaries you support. I believe - probably as you do - that missionary work (humanitarian, evangelical, relational, etc.) is a lot more important than government programs.
Rachel Mallino said…
Bible Thumper, I don't know where you live, but private schools are very expensive and no one I know, including myself, sends their children to private schools! In fact, growing up, that was always reserved for those "with money". I do have a sister-in-law who home schools her two daughters. However, that is very different.

Your "plan" should you ever lose your job almost sounds good - the problem is, you said you would "rent" land and that means you would have to "sell" something in order to pay for your land. I proposed the problem of our economy and people not having the money to buy your "product" - so you solution doesn't work.

I'm just amazed that you are able to save so much money on a compensation less than 75,000 a year, a house that you have already paid off (really??), and you send your children to private school. All of this while wifey gets to stay home and not work! Seriously?! Please, tell me how you do it. And I'm being totally serious. And don't tell me the "bible" told you how.
Rachel Mallino said…
And just so you know - you, personally, don't pay into unemployment benefits as an employee. Only the employer pays those fees to the state government.
Bible thumper wingnut said…
Rachel Mallino,
I like your questions. They are very good questions. Before I answer them I'll answer this one. The money that the employer pays into the unemployment fund, is money that could have been given to you personally to save. So you as the employee looses out on that front. There's overhead of the government managing that fund too. Not to mention the overhead of government owned or leased buildings to house these unemployment departments.

Point being its better to give it straight to you than have a middle man handle it.

Also, I make my money as an owner of an S-Corp. Basically, I have one employee and that's me. And I have to pay unemployment on that one employee. Go figure.
Joel Odom said…
Hi, Rachel. I think the main thing is to avoid debt. I work at Georgia Tech and sponsor a grad student who is working to make it through college debt-free. He's really great and I very much applaud that effort.

For folks out of school, it's important to get out of debt and start investing young. Part of this is making sure you maintain a disciplined budget so that you have money left over for investing, even if it means cutting out some typical American luxuries.

I'd suggest looking over these web sites:

http://clarkhoward.com/
http://www.daveramsey.com/
http://www.iwillteachyoutoberich.com/blog/

The bottom line, though, is to get out of and avoid debt by spending less than you earn and investing the excess.

(I think Bible Thumper means that living debt-free is generally considered by Christians to be a Biblical principal. It works for everyone, though!)

Only the best to you.
Rachel Mallino said…
bible,

what you pay into unemployment as an employer is much less than what the actual employee receives in compensation. If you were to give every employee the money you say otherwise goes to the state, an individual employee would never be able to live off of that amount until that person finds a new job.

Joel,

I completely agree! I put down over 30% on my home, my car is paid off, and my husband and I live humbly. However - there is a big difference between myself and bible - bible is somehow able to put his kids through private school AND have enough money to live WITHOUT unemployment benefits, should he lose his job - and I'm sorry but I'm having a hard time believing he is able to do this on such modest means without ever having received a hand-out.

I do not believe Bible is as "middle class" as he pretends to be.
Collin said…
So, bible thumper is a well-off, white collar worker who has already paid of his home and sends his kids to private schools. And you're not voting for McCain? He's the one trying to give the wealthier citizens the bigger tax break and Palin is pandering to your religious beliefs, it would seem like you'd be tithing half your income to get the "mavericks" in office.
Collin said…
And just for clarification, I never told you to leave, I told you to sign your name. Joel and Rachel seem to have no problem doing that. There is an option on Blogger to turn off anonymous comments, which I'm tempted to do just to see if you'll rise to the occasion.
Bible thumper wingnut said said…
Bible Thumper, I don't know where you live, but private schools are very expensive and no one I know, including myself, sends their children to private schools!.....
We do a home school and private school combo.

Your "plan" should you ever lose your job almost sounds good - the problem is, you said you would "rent" land and that means you would have to "sell" something in order to pay for your land. I proposed the problem of our economy and people not having the money to buy your "product" - so you solution doesn't work.
rent, buy or whatever. Maybe I would buy it from some guy desperate to get out – unless he gets bailed out by the government. Our economy is one of the best if not the best in the world. Our unemployment has been steady 5% for as long as I can remember. Now it’s at 6%. I’m taking a stab in the dark here, but I would wager that most countries have unemployment at around 10%. That’s what I’ve seen in other places around the world.

And, my solution would work. If people were that desperate and we were in worse case scenario, then I would sell my food for a high profit to the highest bidder and get rich. Whatever, this is a hypothetical situation that my grandfather’s family followed through the great Depression. Worse economic time ever for our country. They made it.

Look at the pioneers before us. Where did they “work”? Where did they get their paychecks? What do the Amish do?

All I’m saying is that my plan is a lot more creative than: “Gosh, I’ll let the government take care of me.”

I’d say your plan wouldn’t work, cause eventually the government would get used up, with everybody plugged up to it.


I'm just amazed that you are able to save so much money on a compensation less than 75,000 a year, a house that you have already paid off (really??), and you send your children to private school. All of this while wifey gets to stay home and not work! Seriously?! Please, tell me how you do it. And I'm being totally serious. And don't tell me the "bible" told you how.
Sorry to disappoint you, but the Bible help me a lot with this: See this website for details if you like: http://www.crown.org/

My wife and I participated in a 12 week Bible Study offered by Crown. In that Bible study, we learned that we are just stewards of our positions and that God really owns everything. We learned how to live by a budget. We lived sacrificially. While our neighbors were fleecing new BMWs, getting huge flat screen plasma TVs on a credit card, going out to eat at restaurants every other night and blowing money like crazy we were focused buying old paid for Honda’s to drive, we didn’t have cable, we ate beans and rice. I hustled by doing side jobs and my wife did too during that time all the while I had an entry level corporate job. I drove a very beat up out dated Honda to work while my colleagues drove brand new SUVs (that came with a payment).

With no car payment, you can do a lot right there.
Later, we stared listening to Dave Ramsey. He basically just confirmed everything we learned and experienced. But was refreshing to hear on the radio: http://www.daveramsey.com

It comes down to focus, intent and passion. In 4 years, we went from $40,000 in student loan and credit card debt to that being paid off with a surplus. Later we sold our house and downsized, paying for the 2nd house with the equity from the first. You see, when everybody was refi-ing to get at that equity, we didn’t touch it. We were disciplined.
Bible thumper wingnut said…
Collin,
Does $75,000 / year for married filing jointly sound well off to you? I'd say middle class. But hey, maybe I'm wrong there.
Bible thumper wingnut said…
I'll post my budget here later today.
Pris said…
Collin
I just read the posts here. My own feeling is that I would turn off anonyomous comments. I've rarely seen them used well or wisely. Anyone who won't identify him or herself isn't welcome on my blog.

But I wanted to comment on gas. You mentioned everyone filling up extra. Is there not a limit at the pumps in Georgia? Here, at least in South Florida, you pump to a certain dollar amount (I can't recall what right now) and the pump shuts off, full tank or not. I hope this settles out soon. The big crisis in the seventies was partly real and a very big part panic, too.
Rachel Mallino said…
bible - curious - do you have any medical problems? Does anyone in your family have any medical problems?
Collin said…
Pris, some stations have tried to put limits on the amount of gas being purchased, but have been unable to regulate it. When you pay at the pump with a debit or credit card, there is apparently no way to turn off the pump. It would require cash sales to limit the amount and none of the stations up here have been willing to turn of the credit/debit option.
Joel Odom said…
What would be the point of limiting gas purchases? Would it really have an impact on overall consumption?

My opinion is that we need to tackle energy independence from the supply side and the demand side. We need to drill for domestic oil, we need to find ways to reduce consumption, we need to find gasoline-energy alternatives. Why not attack the problem from all angles?
Rachel Mallino said…
Bible -

"Maybe I would buy it from some guy desperate to get out" ...
"And, my solution would work. If people were that desperate and we were in worse case scenario, then I would sell my food for a high profit to the highest bidder and get rich."


This is the point at which I stop listening to anything that you, in all of your "christian" glory, have to say. Typical republican: take advantage of those worse off, kick them while their down, and get rich while doing so.


Joel -

I think you're right, however, it is selfish to go to the pump and fill up "your" (not necessarily you) SUV and several gas cans while leaving the rest of us without gas. This is why we need "regulation" in many cases, because the majority of the American people are selfish and only think of themselves.
Joel Odom said…
I think it's unfair to say that conservatives "take advantage of those worse off, kick them while their down, and get rich while doing so." Those sorts of generalizations aren't really helpful in understanding one another's thinking.

My church is generally conservative, and we have lots of programs to help the needy in Atlanta and around the world. Compared to other Americans, we are generally middle-class working folks.

I just think it's better to help through charitable giving and personal involvement than through the federal government.
Bible thumper wingnut said…
This is the point at which I stop listening to anything that you, in all of your "christian" glory, have to say. Typical republican: take advantage of those worse off, kick them while their down, and get rich while doing so.

Take it how you want it. That wasn't the point. My point is, you have to create options for yourself. If you're in the position to charge extra money or give the commodity away, that's your business between you and God. For me its clear, God says that as followers of Him we need to help the poor, the fatherless and widows. That's why I support Compassion International.

Collin, if you want to delete my posts - so be it. I have not attacked nor said anything profane. Your blog your business. It seems that I may have tweaked a few nerves posing an alternative point of view.
Collin said…
Since the Dems have folded on blocking drilling offshore - a very disappointing decision - I wonder how the Republicans will spin the fuel shortages and rising oil prices over the next ten years while we're waiting for all the new oil rigs to come online. It's not going to happen overnight. The "drill, baby,drill" crowd is sadly misinformed on the timeline.

I agree, Joel, that we need to find alternative energy sources, but more drilling is not the answer. We should be doing less drilling and looking for more sustainable fuel sources at home such as bio-diesel. Hell even oil magnate T. Boone Pickens said we were not going to be able to drill ourselves out of the fact that America has 3% of the world's oil and gas reserves, but consumes 25% of its energy. I'm with T. Boone -- more wind, more solar, and alternative fuels.
Collin said…
Bible thumper, are you not listening? I'm not deleting you, I just want you to own up to your statements by putting your name where your mouth is. It's incredibly unfair to preach here anonymously when all the other commenters have manned - and womanned -- up and signed their names. That's all I'm saying.
Joel Odom said…
All of that stuff is great. I'd love to see more renewable and nuclear energy come online. We need it for energy independence.

But why not take advantage of every opportunity? Why not drill, too?
Collin said…
Joel, we need to move away from oil PERIOD! There's been an ad running on television (can't remember which oil company is sponsoring it) that says there is enough untapped oil off the US coast to last 60 years. Okay, that sounds like a long time and we'll be dead and it won't matter to us, but what about the future generations. I would hope in 60 years that using oil, for the most part, would be a thing of the past.
Rachel Mallino said…
Drilling only placates the American public. I, personally, don't believe in a "quick fix" - we got ourselves into this mess, now we have to live with it, and hopefully while we're living with it, we make better choices.

The fact that mass transit is not talked about more, really distresses me.
Joel Odom said…
Yup. We do need to move away from burning hydrocarbons (coal and oil). Don't tell my conservative friends, but I secretly envy folks who drive Priuses. I hope hybrid and pure electric technology continues to mature.

The energy has to come from someplace though. Renewable is ideal. Modern nuclear is good. Oil and coal and (to a lesser extent) natural gas are just yucky from a pollution standpoint.

I think we should drill for oil to help ease the transition to alternative energy. Long term, we need to move away from it. (It will be a very long time, though, before you see the world's first electric airliner.)
Rachel Mallino said…
Joel - re: generalization-

Yes, but if the shoe fits....
Joel Odom said…
Rachel, you know little to nothing about me. Can you give me one example of when I have ever done anything like this?

"take advantage of those worse off, kick them while their down, and get rich while doing so."

Sorry to be a little confrontational, and you don't have to answer that, but I consider such name calling entirely unproductive.

Respectfully submitted.
Rupert said…
AS I said 40 comments before, lol, - Reagan and his free-market, voodoo economics started the whole mess - Free Market Capitalism actually does NOT work because there is an inherent human greed factor that Adam Smith and Ayn Rand neglected to figure into the equation - people who have more *want* more . . . at the expense of the lower rungs on the social Darwinism ladder - this always leads to either borderline fascism (ahem)or violent revolution -
Pris said…
Collin, do you know how I can opt out of getting post notifications of the comments to this blog post? Your post was good but this endless bickering is starting to get on my nerves and I get a notice with the contents in it every time someone comments. I can't find anything to click to turn that off. I opted for notifications when I read the post because it was interesting.
Rachel Mallino said…
I haven't ruled out violent revolution. I think it's time for the dems to get a spine and we go to revolution phase. I said it not long ago on my own blog.

I'm tired of being pushed around on the play-ground.
Pris said…
Aha...after the comment posted, there was an unsubscribe box.
Collin said…
I'm closing comments on this one. I think the topic has run it's course and besides there is much bigger breaking news right now: McCain's political theatre move of suspending his campaign and trying to derail the debate. Post coming soon.

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